# What motherboard should I purchase? (Solve, Completed)

## mtw85

Hello I am new to the Gentoo forums, anyway I just want to have a suggestion for what motherboard should I get for my custom computer, like I'm using this computer for gaming and as a workstation any suggestions? Thank you.

P.S. I was researching for one and I looked at the GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) would be fine but I don't know. Also I'm not going for like the latest tech and not very expensive, just some hardware that was made like 2 or 3 years ago. Thank you.Last edited by mtw85 on Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

Welcome to the forums.

Don't think about the motherboard in isolation. You need to consider the motherboard, RAM and CPU requirements together.

e.g. If you will ever want more than 64G RAM in the life of the system, you need 4 DIMM slots.

If you expect to upgrade the CPU, buy a motherboard that can take the best CPU you are likely to want.

Any motherboard chip set less than the X570 will only give you a single PCIe Gen 4 slot, for the primary graphics card.

Will that be OK for the life of the system?

Personally, a motherboard is for the life of the system, I don't replace them. GPUs and RAM on the other hard are upgrade targets and the old ones get passed on as upgrades to other family members.

I put a new system together in early September. They are in short supply. I had to get a motherboard with features that I'll never use because I couldn't get the one I wanted.

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## mtw85

Thank you for the suggestion, yeah I do need 4 DIMM slots because I want to maintain this computer for a long time. Also what about the type of brand because I researched and some other companies like AS Rock and MSI are not a great idea, which should I choose thank you. Also this computer is going to have AMD processor and Radion graphics card to be specific. The processer that I want to have is AMD and it about three to two years old like a Ryzen 7, but not the latest processor.

P.S Sorry I'm kind of new to building custom computers.

By the way thank you for welcoming me to the community I really appreciate it.   :Smile: 

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## technotorpedo

Was hoping NeddySeagoon could link to a posting about the bucket list system, thing sounds like a monster and I'd be interested to read more about it. What geek and Linux user doesn't like talking about their hardware and specs afterall ?  :Smile: 

@OP .. Seems like such a potentially complicated subject I don't have anything to offer, plus ... am not a gamer, never bothered focusing much on the topic ... outside of basics and that subject has to be almost a specialty field of gnu/Linux. Do think it couldn't hurt joining and/or stalking forums devoted to the topic and asking in those communities too. Gaming is no doubt a specific niche in gnu/Linux and like any niche that has a lot of interest, do know there are distro's dedicated to it. Would imagine they'd know plenty about the hardware side of things too. Have some good discussion and info for whoever wants to look over. Hope your build turns out well.  :Smile: 

 *Quote:*   

> Funny sidenote: Linux user ... going through his wallet with some acquaintances, errrrrr, yeah what's that ? Oh ... that's my new system, ... hmmmm, okay, who are those people ? Ah those are just my kids, here's some more pics of my system though.  

 

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## mtw85

Well this system is not like a beast of system, like I want to use it for some gaming and mostly like a workstation so like nothing to fancy. And sorry. Maybe not a Ryzen 7 something lower but I will research. So to sum it up a system that is not too latest tech something that you could still game on, use mostly like a workstation, and hardware that can last a long time. Also Thank you for the suggestion.

P.S. sorry for my grammar.

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## DaggyStyle

 *mtw85 wrote:*   

> GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi

 

had a similar board on my main setup, worked great with ram OC to 3.2Ghz, got fried a few months ago, now I have an asus b450 plus, can only work up to 3Ghz.

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## mtw85

So you think that the motherboard I selected could be alright for what I need like just for some gaming and mostly use of college and workstation (GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) . If so, I do need to have it support expansion slots like two or three max. Sorry If I'm confusing the topic a bit. Also I don't plan to overclock.

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## technotorpedo

No worries my grammar (how badly it sucks) is the stuff of legend in some circles.  :Very Happy: 

For whatever reason got the impression gaming was more of a focus. Still think there's merit in what was suggested. Such communties (gamer distro's or boards) should be discussing topics like best bang for a users buck hardware and pitfalls or OEM's known to be trouble. Comes to Linux and hardware overall, still think is a complicated affair but I tend to over-think just about everything. Things are subject to changing, up and downs, a brand might be good here, fall off there. A few times I've taken a stab at what you're describing, trying to zero in on sources of info which make it easier to identify OEM's that are consistently good for open source and those who are known to be problematic.

Never came across an authority database on it and that would be awesome if such a thing existed. Many distro's, quite likely this one tend to have a list your specs or show your system kind of threads. Always seemed like one place maybe worth checking. Sounds like you've already done some research and are thinking things through. I tend to agree with you that cutting edge hardware maybe not being best on the Linux platform, with open source taking a bit of time to catch up, am happy to think that's changing though.

You also mentioned AMD/Radeon, with them working more closely and open sourcing graphics drivers etc. Would stand to reason future would be getting brighter for people using that brand. Don't quote me on that though, as don't want to mislead you/anybody. Just the impression I got. Been awhile since comparing AMD vs Intel but generally always gotten the impression AMD offers a bit more, for a bit less. Definitely don't quote me there and then there's the Intel side-channel fiasco, Spectre and Meltdown and rampaging Gremlin on crack or whatever the latest exploit they've found in those old Intel's may be.  :Very Happy: 

Only graphic's entity that's long been on my avoid list would have to be Nvidia, am sure there are plenty of people getting good results with their stuff too, only seen many a horror story from a Linux user related to them and if Linus Torvalds resorted to publicly giving them the finger ... you know ?

Personally don't think OEM's not jumping to support gnu/Linux are so much evil, it's just business and they reasonably enough don't want to invest a ton of effort into a small market segment, they're in it to make money. Still also as more people start using Linux, more users .. more potential profit. Thus do think things are changing for the better and more people are taking notice. Still always gotten the impression Nvidia has demonstrated a tad more hostility towards Linux users than needed. Thus the one finger salute from a guy like Linus T. Anyone who watches him on stuff like Youtube, a person can tell he's a fairly nice and level headed guy. 

Must be bad for him to have gone that far with it. Well actually have read about it and yes, he and other people openly discuss Nvidia treating open source like a red-headed stepchild. Only 2 cents, too much coffee and A LOT of typing.  :Smile: 

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## mtw85

Thank you for the response I really appreciate it, I will check with other gaming topic forums on the subject. And thank you for your help. Also yeah I done some research I believe that this mother-board is the best for my needs (GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) I just thought there might be some other options, but I think I'll stick with it. Also what processor type should I use for both gaming and workstation, I want to stick with the Ryzen series anything from 5-7 or something like that not too old and not too new. Thank you.

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## DaggyStyle

 *mtw85 wrote:*   

> Thank you for the response I really appreciate it, I will check with other gaming topic forums on the subject. And thank you for your help. Also yeah I done some research I believe that this mother-board is the best for my needs (GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) I just thought there might be some other options, but I think I'll stick with it. Also what processor type should I use for both gaming and workstation, I want to stick with the Ryzen series anything from 5-7 or something like that not too old and not too new. Thank you.

 

be sure you get fast ram and that not all ryzens have apus

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## mtw85

Alright thank you so much for the help so I'll keep that in mind to get fast ram. Thank you for help everyone have a nice day.   :Smile: 

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## technotorpedo

^ Think dang good point too DaggyStyle. This has prompted my starting a thread. You're welcome for the wall of babblings @mtw85 and you're in the right place, no doubt a TON of very knowledgeable/experienced Linux users and techies among the Gentoo crowd. Think previous posts made it clear I kind of favor AMD but don't want to champion them exclusively. Sounds like you're already leaning towards a mobo/AMD based system. 

Have seen Linux users in places discussing Ryzen's and believe overall gotten good reviews from those users. Errrr .. though I excel at finding new and exciting ways to bork Linux operating systems, more than in assembling of hardware. So ya may want to wait for more qualified feedback.  :Razz:  Could help a bit too giving people here some idea of price range you're looking at. I mean it might influence suggestions somewhat.

Personally I favor buying used anyway, as I tend to stay broke. So really Intel/AMD doesn't so much matter to me, will still tend to avoid Nvidia, of course depending on spec$ and price, though mentioned I don't game, so nouveau would suit my needs anyway. Only ever use pc's for the same thing majority of people do with them and thanks to Linux, even dated hardware blazes along fine ...

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## Anon-E-moose

 *mtw85 wrote:*   

> Alright thank you so much for the help so I'll keep that in mind to get fast ram. Thank you for help everyone have a nice day.  

 

Most MB manufacturers will have a list of memory vendors that are guaranteed to work with their MB. Go to the web site and look in the support area for that motherboard.

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## technotorpedo

Way over my posting quota but another good tip if don't already know it OP is using google advanced search, I really like the site: operator such as in the following search example ...

```
site:https://forums.gentoo.org Intel vs AMD
```

Going to delete that thread I started, as it's a topic that's no doubt been discussed and done to death already. Could try searches for Ryzen 5 and etc too though. See what the Gentoo community thinks about whichever topics.  :Smile:  Probably double back later,  to check out some searches on it too, as I'd like to know what people here think about it.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

I chose an X570 based motherboard because I wanted some future proofing.

My last PC was used for 12 years. If this PC lasts 12 years it may last longer than me.

The B... chipsets would do me today but maybe not in 5 years.

Having settled on the X570 chipset, the motherboard needed to be passively cooled. Mostly because small fans are noisy and don't last very long.

Passively cooled X570 chipset motherboards narrows the choice quite a lot.

It had to have 4 DIMM slots. My old motherboard started out with 2x2G sticks in 2009 and that was plenty. In 2019, its 16G maximum was no longer enough.

I did think of fitting 32Gx2 now and adding another 32Gx2 later but I'm supposed to be a pensioner, so there will not be much spare cash for PC updates.

I have a part time job right now, so I put the 128G max RAM in from day one. Its supposed to be 3200MHz capable but that needs over volting various bits and pieces, so it won't be happening here.

The CPU is a AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16-Core Processor because I'm not likely to have cash for updates once I retire again :)

I did not get a new video card. There are none to be had in the UK for sensible money.  The video card was migrated from the old PC. Its a  Radeon 540/540X/550/550X.

I'm not a gamer but I do have a 4k display. A video card, possibly a Radeon 5600 based card is a possibility.

Back to the motherboard. I expressly did not want WiFi or Bluetooth. My home network is physically segregated into trusted (Gentoo devices), untrusted wireless devices, e.g. Android devices. I did not want any accidental combined devices. While I found specs of suitable motherboards, there were none for sale.

I also did not want any flashing lights. The PC just sits there almost out of sight, its not a work of art. I had to have flashing lights too.

The 1TB NVMe card is PCIe4 to match the slots it goes in.

The PSU is well derated.   Its an 850w unit bu probably never goes much over 500w. It will be quieter and last longer that way.

There is some rotating rust storage too. My /home is huge as almost nothing gets deleted. distfiles and packages are OK on conventional HDD, as magnetic drives are good at sequential access.

That's my rationale for my choices.

"Choices" is a bit of an overstatement. After that, it was a case of whats in stock, nowish or with believable dates.

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## Anon-E-moose

Neddy, about the memory, if the memory chips have xmp capability (many do) then you could use that setting and the mb should adjust all power settings properly for the "3200" speed.

That's how I set my mem, which is 3600, and it runs stable, I just set the xmp profile on the mb.

Edit to add: I'm glad I bought mine parts early 2020 before the supplies got ridiculous out/short supply/etc. 

Should have bought another video card, as they were reasonable at that time. "oh well"

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## NeddySeagoon

Anon-E-moose,

I'm a retired hardware engineer. XMP is another name for 'overclocking'. :)

The BIOS says its supported.

Maybe in a few years  but while rust builds in under 15 minutes

```
$ sudo genlop -t rust

Password: 

 * dev-lang/rust

     Wed Sep  8 01:08:38 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.54.0

       merge time: 12 minutes and 34 seconds.

     Mon Sep 13 21:39:30 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.55.0

       merge time: 13 minutes and 21 seconds.

     Mon Oct 25 16:02:19 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.56.0-r1

       merge time: 13 minutes and 44 seconds.

     Thu Oct 28 20:49:23 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.56.0-r1

       merge time: 13 minutes and 40 seconds.

     Tue Nov  2 08:35:58 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.56.1

       merge time: 13 minutes and 34 seconds.

     Sat Nov 13 12:50:17 2021 >>> dev-lang/rust-1.56.1

       merge time: 13 minutes and 30 seconds.

```

 I don't feel the same need for speed as I did with the just retired Phenom II.

For the terminally curious, the shopping list was

Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow Edition Full Tower PC Case

Thermal Paste Arctic MX-4 (2022) 

AMD Ryzen 5950x

Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black CPU Cooler

Corsair Vengeance LPX Black 64G 3200MHz DDR4 x 2

850W Corsair RM Series RM850 Full Modular, 80PLUS Gold,

1TB Samsung 980 PRO, M.2 (2280), PCIe 4.0 (x4) NVMe SSD

Toshiba X300 4TB * 4

Akasa InterConnect EX card reader for 5.25" Bay 

ASUS AMD Ryzen X570 ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero

I didn't want that motherboard because it has WiFi, Bluetooth and lots of flashing lights. It was also a lot more expensive than the one I wanted.

I ended up with 4 8TB HDD because I couldn't get 4TB ones. There wan not a huge price difference there.

A 128G RAM pack of the same sticks was £200 more expensive that 2 64G packs.

There is no video card as I couldn't get a new one for a sane price.

As I've hinted, its probably a 'bucket list' system. :)

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## mtw85

Thank you for an example bucket list and yeah that a bit expensive but I check this motherboard out, but I'm going to stick with my original picked board. Is it ok for a start cause I'm new to custom built computers.

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## Anon-E-moose

 *NeddySeagoon wrote:*   

> Anon-E-moose,
> 
> I'm a retired hardware engineer. XMP is another name for 'overclocking'. 
> 
> The BIOS says its supported.

 

It's getting common for mb makers to support xmp, and the memory vendors are supporting it.

Yeah, it's overclocking ... but it's automatic.  :Laughing: 

On the other hand, the memory will stay cooler running at a lower speed. Everything is a trade off  :Wink: 

 *Quote:*   

> I don't feel the same need for speed as I did with the just retired Phenom II.

 

I hear you on the upgrade. 

 *Quote:*   

> 
> 
> ASUS AMD Ryzen X570 ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero
> 
> I didn't want that motherboard because it has WiFi, Bluetooth and lots of flashing lights. It was also a lot more expensive than the one I wanted.
> ...

 

Yeah, I had looked at the the ROG, but it didn't quite fit my needs (and at the time I had plenty of choices) and I wanted plenty of pcie slots, so I went with the Prime X570 Pro.

I swear they've gone nuts with lights ... on everything, 1st thing I do is turn them off. With fans, I just clip the led leads  :Laughing: 

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

It looks like a good place to start.  Its reasonably upgradeable.

Think about the Video system you will start with. That motherboard can support a CPU with internal Graphics.

No separate video card required. If that is how you intend to go, that's fine.

If you will install a separate Video card, you are paying for motherboard features you will not use.

Combined GPU/CPU is generally a bad thing as the GPU pixel buffer is in main memory, not in the video card RAM.

This means that the GPU and CPU have to share the available bandwith.

The GPU needs to refresh the image on the display surface and draw the next image into the pixel buffer, so that memory bandwidth is lost to the CPU.

If you intent is to start with a combination GPU/CPU and add a separate graphics card later, that motherboard looks good.

I want comment on  Gigabyte as a vendor as I have never used them.

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## technotorpedo

 *Quote:*   

> NeddySeagoon wrote:
> 
> The PC just sits there almost out of sight, its not a work of art. 

 

Sounds pretty dang close though .. Nice system and surely don't call it a bucket list item for nothing eh.  Thanks for listing stats and esp the reasoning behind it, what was selected and why, seems a lot of thought went into your build and ended with a beast that can handle anything you want to throw at it.  :Smile: 

That's another thing I remind myself to be grateful for on this side of the pond. Access to affordable consumer electronics. Seen plenty of fellow geeks and Linux users discussing VAT's and this and that's and sounds like it stinks a bit. Annoys me even if not directly affected. Ah but the US govt doesn't care what I think/say, so pretty sure the one's in the UK could give a crap less. Also afraid you've got to stick around for longer than 12 more yrs. Aren't enough grey beards to go around, if you kick the bucket, who are all us young whipper snapper geeks gonna pester for information ?  :Razz: 

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## mtw85

Alright I believe that is what I need to know thank you for the help everyone, oh one more question which Ryzen is a good processor to start I heard Ryzen 5 3600 is a good start but what do you think? All I need is a powerful processor that is not too old and not too new just right and last a longtime.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

That's a processor only. You will need a Graphics card too.

Why buy a motherboard that can take a GPU/CPU combo then not use it?

You may be able to get a better motherboard without the video output hardware that that CPU cannot use.

Take care that you do not get an old stock motherboard. Your chosen CPU is Zen3.

Early versions of that motherboard were Zen1 and Zen2 only. They needed a BIOS update to work with Zen3 CPUs.

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## mtw85

Oh I am aware of that, I plan to purchase a Radion graphics card. Question I'm new to this but how do you update your motherboard firmware in Linux?

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## Goverp

One more thing to consider - support for ECC (error correcting) memory.

Researchers keep finding new Rowhammer attacks; maybe they're practical now; and

predicted error rates (from cosmic rays and the like) are (I forget the details) something like one bit flip every 10 hours for 16 GB memory; mostly they will be in unused memory (due to C's wasteful memory management), but sometimes things will break.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

Motherboard firmware update methods are vendor specific. 

Often but not always, they supply a FreeDOS bootable image for a USB stick/CDROM/Floppy

Read the motherboard manual for your motherboard before you buy.

The short answer in that you don't do the update from Linux, you prepare the bootable media in Linux.

Don't buy a second hand Graphics card. It will have been thrashed within an inch of its life by crypto currency miners.

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## mtw85

Alright I researched my motherboard it according to the manufacture it has a non ecc unbuffered memory DDR4 and 4 DIMMs slots, would that be ideal because I don't plan to overclock my memory anytime soon.

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## mtw85

NeddySeagoon thank you for your advice on my motherboard selection, anyway you mentioned about the graphics card, what do you mean by second hand and also can you explain me the firmware update if its necessary.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

Cosmic Ray induced 'soft errors' are a natural phenomena. ECC memory cad detect and correct single bit errors.

I know its anecdotal but I've not noticed any such errors in the logs for my arm64 server, which has 128G ECC DDG3 RAM.

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## Anon-E-moose

Many of the latest motherboards allow you to update the firmware by sticking a usb stick (with the update) in one specific usb port. 

So no need, in that case, for os/windows.

As far as memory, I look at what the total memory allowed is (128gb is common now), but unless you're going with a mini style mb, you're likely to see 4 memory slots.

As far as the video card, I'm with Neddy, go with new vs trying to buy a "used" card.

The problem is too many cards have been "used" to cryptomine, which places a strain upon the video card (possibly shortening it's life).

Even when I bought cards from ebay (before they became too expensive) I would always buy them new.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

I think that this page allows you to download the manual.

There is a facility in the BIOS called Q-Flash, for updating the BIOS but other than pressing F8 to access it, I don't see it described further. 

It has its own page

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## mtw85

Alright so would you suggested I get the same motherboard but it has built in ecc because I heard that AMD allows you the option to use ecc or not, and also thanks for showing me tips on updating the motherboard if needed. And yeah I am going for a new graphics card not a used.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

ECC adds to the cost and slows down the RAM access, to do the error checking.

AMD CPU do indeed support ECC but not all motherboards do. They can cut costs by leaving bits off.

ECC RAM will still fit but the ECC bits cannot be used.

I'm aware of the Cosmic Ray issue but I've not seen any problems with the one system I have that is able to detect them.

Read the fine print in the motherboard manual and weigh up the pros and cons of ECC, if your motherboard even supports it.

I would go so far to suggested that if Cosmic Rays were still the problem they were in the early days of DRAM, every motherboard would support ECC RAM and it might even be compulsory. 

In the early days of DRAM a 64kB (yes kilo byte) DRAM array needed to have Hamming Error Detection and Correction to be useful at all.

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## mtw85

Alright thank you so much for your help but just one more question should I choose this motherboard (GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) that has a non ecc unbuffered or should I get another motherboard that supports this module. I'm just a bit confused.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

I would use non-ECC RAM. Well, I do in my main system.

The only reason my ARM64 server has ECC RAM is that someone didn't know what they were selling on ebay, so I got it for well under half the price I was expecting to pay.

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## Anon-E-moose

I don't run with ecc memory, never have, but that's for me as a person, if I were a business or using the comp for business I might investigate ecc memory.

Having said that I don't think I've ever had a non-reproducible problem that might have been related to memory and cosmic rays. 

In other words it's not been a problem for me.

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## NeddySeagoon

Anon-E-moose,

I must have a longer memory than you :)

I've not had a problem since DRAMs swapped from being p-channel to n-channel, (or the other way around). That addressed most but not all the soft error issues.

Oh, the encapsulation was changed to remove as much radioactive material as was possible too. That was another source of DRAM soft errors.

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## mtw85

Alright everyone thank you so much for the assistance I will be purchasing these parts today, and I'll let you know how the setup is set. I'll now rename this topic as solve, thank you everyone.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

You need to post your shopping list.

The parts we have discussed will not work without a graphics card.

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## mtw85

Oh ok well first on the list is:

GIGABYTE B450 AORUS PRO Wi-Fi (AMD Ryzen AM4/ATX/M.2 Thermal Guard with Onboard Wi-Fi/HDMI/DVI/USB 3.1 Gen 2/DDR4/Motherboard) 

AMD Ryzen 5 (need help on choosing though)

Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 DRAM 3200MHz C16 Desktop Memory Kit - Black (CMK16GX4M2B3200C16)  (2x)

Radion Graphics card (still searching )

Power Supply (still searching)

That is what I have at the moment I still need to keep researching for the other parts. I will keep updating the list

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

If that's 4x8G RAM sticks, consider 2x16G sticks instead.  Its that same amount of RAM but leaves two RAM slots free.

That way you can add more later without removing 2 existing sticks.

You will add more later too, if you keep this system.

The PSU will be determined in part by the graphics card. My card is 35w max and powered from the PCIe bus.

Some monsters have power connectors and can draw over 200w. That influences choice of PSU.

Don't skimp on the PSU, you will add more things to the system and replace older parts with more power hungry parts over the life of the system.

Also, PSU failure can be very hard to diagnose.

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## mtw85

Alright and which Ryzen should I choose? I'm sticking with gen 2 and the Ryzen 5 series.

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## mtw85

Oh one last question what online retailer should I shop for these item? Amazon cause of Amazon Prime or Newegg.

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## Hu

Both are generally reputable, so I would say buy from whichever gives you a better deal on the parts you picked.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

I bought my bits from Scan and Ebuyer. Mostly because they had the stuff between them that I wanted.

Also, where there was overlap, unless it was for offers, there was little price difference.

The cynic in me says that's a cartel but electronics is a very competitive marketplace too, so margins are squeezed.   

Amazon were expensive and I've had them deliver boxes of scrap HDD because they don't know how to pack them.

I tend to avoid Amazon for electronics after they failed to learn the packing lesson the the first time.

To be clear, this was 'instores' but packed and shipped by Amazon.

It only took a few days to get my money back. Amazon were very good there but it delayed my HDD.

newegg is not a an option in the UK. 

mtw85,

You don't mention any storage devices.

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## Tony0945

Amazon shipped me a hard cover book in a huge box with NO padding at all. Amazingly the dustcover was okay but the end boards were bent.

If you take out a NewEgg credit card they may offer one year zero interest or another promotion.  WATCH OUT for Newegg "partners" or "affiliates" or whatever they call them. These are just people who should be on e-bay paying to use Newegg's ordering system (and name).  Order from Newegg with Fulfillment by Newegg.

Their address is "Port of Los Angeles" which implies to me that they are dockside.  Lot's of TV news stories about hundreds of ships with empty shipping containers clogging the docks.  (crews have covid?)

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## mtw85

NeddySeagoon 

Hey sorry I didn't reply back today I was busy anyway storage devices I have in my current computer on 1 terabyte ssd Samsung 860 EVO. So I do plan to use that as my storage device and this is new I bought it like 5-4 months ago. And also I know I should avoid Nvidia but on my old computer I do have a NVIDIA GTX 950 would that still work for opengl and vulkan because at the moment I don't yet plan to purchase a Radeon Graphics card because the market is so inflated. This will be temporary.

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

Look at your  GTX 950 and the Radon card you would like.

Provision the PSU for the most power, when you add that to the rest of the system, then double it.

That will give you a PSU that is comfortably derated now and has headroom for growth.

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## mtw85

Alright thank you have the advice for the PSU, so anything I need to know when installing drivers on my system when it is completed? Like tips for building the kernel with Nvidia support? Also what do you mean by doubling it?

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

Add up all the power required for your system as it will be when you have the bits you plan to get now. Including your Radeon graphics card.

Whatever that adds up to be, double it.

That's the minimum power output PSU you should fit.

So if it comes to 350w, find a PSU about 700w.

It will have an easy low stress life to start with. That's good for its reliability.

Then you begin to add more parts or swap lower power parts for higher power parts.

That's all the bits you don't even know about today that you will fit in the coming years. 

Provision the PSU to cope with the expansion.

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## mtw85

Alright thank you for that advice I will search for that then. Also should I get an optical drive?

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## NeddySeagoon

mtw85,

That depends on what you will use it for.

I have a multilayer Bluray writer than has its main use for backups on dual layer media and ripping the odd film to the media server.

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