# qmail smtp with ssl/tls does not work - please help me

## CB2206

hi everyone,

i hope someone is able to help me, this is driving me nuts.  :Sad: 

i set up qmail/vpopmail/courier-imap with the gentoo qmail howto on gentoo.org.

receiving mail works perfectly with pop3-ssl and imap-ssl without any problem.

but i am not able to send any email using smtp with ssl/tls. thunderbird says:

```

The message could not be sent because connecting to SMTP server <my_server> failed. The server may be unavailable or is refusing SMTP connections. Please verify that your SMTP server setting is correct and try again, or else contact your network administrator.

```

The SSL/TLS connection should not be the problem, because running this command

```

openssl s_client -connect <my_server>:25 -starttls smtp

```

on my notebook opens a encrypted connection and i can use "helo <my_fqdn>" etc.

/var/log/qmail/qmail-smtpd/current says:

```

@4000000043674ff80c3d1844 tcpserver: status: 1/40

@4000000043674ff80c3d27e4 tcpserver: pid 8085 from 134.155.28.24

@4000000043674ff80c3d2bcc tcpserver: ok 8085 0:213.239.213.54:25 :134.155.28.24::61940

@4000000043674ff820255114 tcpserver: end 8085 status 256

@4000000043674ff8202560b4 tcpserver: status: 0/40

```

status should be 0 instead of 256. but i do not know what 256 means. 

Sending mail without ssl/tls works when sending to adresses of the same server. otherwise i get:

```

553 sorry, that domain isn't in my list of allowed rcpthosts; no valid cert for gatewaying (#5.7.1)

```

/var/qmail/control/conf-smtp

```

QMAIL_SMTP_AUTHHOST=$(<${QMAIL_CONTROLDIR}/me)

[ -z "${QMAIL_SMTP_POST}" ] && QMAIL_SMTP_POST=/bin/true

QMAIL_SMTP_CHECKPASSWORD="/var/vpopmail/bin/vchkpw"

QMAIL_SMTP_POST="${QMAIL_SMTP_AUTHHOST} ${QMAIL_SMTP_CHECKPASSWORD} ${QMAIL_SMTP_POST}"

```

/etc/tcp.rules.d/

```

127.0.0.1:allow,RELAYCLIENT="",RBLSMTPD="",QMAILQUEUE="/var/qmail/bin/qmail-scanner-queue" 

<ip_address_of_the_server>:allow,RELAYCLIENT="",RBLSMTPD="",QMAILQUEUE="/var/qmail/bin/qmail-scanner-queue" 

:allow,QMAILQUEUE="/var/qmail/bin/qmail-scanner-queue"

```

Sending mail using horde-imp (webmail) works without problems.

Here are the final questions:

(1) Why am i not able to send mail with ssl/tls?

(2) Is this a authentication problem? If yes, where should i search?

(3) How do i disable sending mails withouth encryption completely?

Thank you very much for any answer/idea!

best regards

christian

----------

## m4chine

My first guess is that relaying if borking, try changing your tcprules for smtp to

```
127.0.0.1:allow,RELAYCLIENT="",RBLSMTPD=""

<ip_of_server>:allow,RELAYCLIENT="",RBLSMTPD=""

:allow,QMAILQUEUE="/var/qmail/bin/qmail-scanner-queue"
```

There is also a great howto for what you are doing at https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-382072-highlight-.html that might lend some help.

Let us know if this helps.

----------

## m4chine

My next suggestion would be to open a terminal on the server and 

```
tail -f /var/log/mail.*
```

Then send an email from a client machine via SMTP SSL/TSL and look for the errors. It should give a descent description why the mail fails to deliver.

Also, have you tried sending mail with another mail client besides Thunderbird? I Experienced errors like the one Thunderbird gives you when I had  Symantec AV scanning Internet Mail, it was fixed by disabling Internet Mail scanning in Symantec. This is a know problem with Outlook/Outlook Express and documented in the topic I linked earlier. Hope this helps.

----------

## CB2206

Sending mail with ssl/tls does not produce any messages in mail.* files.

I tried it with Thunderbird (Mac) and Apple Mail. A friend of mine tested it with Outlook and it did not work as well.

----------

## m4chine

Did you have a chance to look at that post I linked you to? Any steps you may have missed? I just settup two mail servers based on that howto, using SSL/TSL and have no hickups.

 *CB2206 wrote:*   

> 
> 
> ```
> 
> 553 sorry, that domain isn't in my list of allowed rcpthosts; no valid cert for gatewaying (#5.7.1)
> ...

 

This message sounds like you have created a cert for (example) mail.domain.com (which has the MX records) but you box name is server.domain.com and the client is complaining that the cert isn't for server.domain.com. Thats a possibilty.

But since you can only send mail to your server, while offsite, tells me that relaying is b0rked. Did you try to change tcprules and re-applying them?

Anyone one else have some thoughts? Let us know.

----------

## CB2206

Hi,

I am at the moment not at home. I will check this probably tomorrow evening.

Thanks a lot for your efforts.

Best regards,

Christian

----------

## CB2206

Hi,

sorry for the delay.

(1) Changing the tcprules for smtp as you mentioned did not help. 

(2) I double checked all the steps of the howto, nothing changed.

(3) /var/log/mail* files do not contain any information about sending mail

(4) Tested with clients Thunderbird (Mac), Apple Mail, Outlook 2003 -> everywhere the same error.

(5a) Sending with SSL/TLS does not work -> Thunderbird: server refuses connection

(5b) Sending without SSL/TLS to domains which are hosted on the same server -> works

(5c) Sending without SSL/TLS to domains which are not hosted on the same server -> gives 553, domain not in list of rcpthosts

--> how do i disable sending without encryption completely?

So...the question is why does SSL/TLS not work?

This seems to work:

```

openssl s_client -connect <mail.server.tld>:25 -starttls smtp

```

This gives the ssl connection information and then:

```

250-<host.server.tld>

250-STARTTLS

250-PIPELINING

250-8BITMIME

250 SIZE 0

helo

250 <host.server.tld>

```

```

250-<host.server.tld>

250-STARTTLS

250-PIPELINING

250-8BITMIME

250 SIZE 0

ehlo <name>

250-<host.server.tld>

250-PIPELINING

250-8BITMIME

250-AUTH LOGIN PLAIN CRAM-MD5

250 SIZE 0

```

When trying to send a mail manually I get the 553 error, if i try to send to external addresses.

I tried to use SMTP Auth manually. But using "auth login" closes the connection after username and password (both base64 encoded) and using "auth plain" i am not sure what i have to send exactly. (got "501 malformed auth input (5.5.4) all the time")

So the question is...why is the connection refused by the smtp server?

After the initial installation of this mail server setup, everything worked for one year. the problems ocurred aprox. 1 month ago. i think it has to be the time when mysql 4.1 got stable and i updated the system. (including recompiling vpopmail etc.) this is what i updated:

```

1130052467: === Sync completed with rsync://213.239.215.148/gentoo-portage

1130053203:  *** terminating.

1130053204: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 09:40:04

1130053204:  *** emerge --ask --verbose --deep --update --newuse world

1130066288:  *** terminating.

1130066412:  >>> emerge (1 of 10) sys-apps/man-pages-2.08 to /

1130066412:  === (1 of 10) Cleaning (sys-apps/man-pages-2.08::/usr/portage/sys-apps/man-pages/man-pages-2.08.ebuild)

1130066413:  === (1 of 10) Compiling/Merging (sys-apps/man-pages-2.08::/usr/portage/sys-apps/man-pages/man-pages-2.08.ebuild)

1130066447:  === (1 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (sys-apps/man-pages-2.08::/usr/portage/sys-apps/man-pages/man-pages-2.08.ebuild)

1130066448:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: sys-apps/man-pages

1130066453: === Unmerging... (sys-apps/man-pages-2.07)

1130066480:  >>> unmerge success: sys-apps/man-pages-2.07

1130066480:  ::: completed emerge (1 of 10) sys-apps/man-pages-2.08 to /

1130066480:  >>> emerge (2 of 10) dev-db/mysql-4.1.14 to /

1130066480:  === (2 of 10) Cleaning (dev-db/mysql-4.1.14::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.1.14.ebuild)

1130066481:  === (2 of 10) Compiling/Merging (dev-db/mysql-4.1.14::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.1.14.ebuild)

1130066504:  *** terminating.

1130066597: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 13:23:17

1130066597:  *** emerge --ask --verbose --buildpkg <mysql-4.1

1130066603:  >>> emerge (1 of 1) dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2 to /

1130066603:  === (1 of 1) Cleaning (dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.0.25-r2.ebuild)

1130066604:  === (1 of 1) Compiling/Packaging (dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.0.25-r2.ebuild)

1130066607:  *** terminating.

1130066611: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 13:23:31

1130066611:  *** emerge --ask --verbose --buildpkg <mysql-4.1

1130066612:  >>> emerge (1 of 1) dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2 to /

1130066612:  === (1 of 1) Cleaning (dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.0.25-r2.ebuild)

1130066613:  === (1 of 1) Compiling/Packaging (dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.0.25-r2.ebuild)

1130066819:  *** terminating.

1130067032: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 13:30:32

1130067032:  *** emerge  unmerge mysql

1130067037: === Unmerging... (dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2)

1130067054:  >>> unmerge success: dev-db/mysql-4.0.25-r2

1130067056:  *** exiting successfully.

1130067064:  *** terminating.

1130067478: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 13:37:58

1130067478:  *** emerge --ask --verbose >mysql-4.1

1130067488:  >>> emerge (1 of 2) dev-db/mysql-4.1.14 to /

1130067488:  === (1 of 2) Cleaning (dev-db/mysql-4.1.14::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.1.14.ebuild)

1130067489:  === (1 of 2) Compiling/Merging (dev-db/mysql-4.1.14::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.1.14.ebuild)

1130069253:  === (1 of 2) Post-Build Cleaning (dev-db/mysql-4.1.14::/usr/portage/dev-db/mysql/mysql-4.1.14.ebuild)

1130069256:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: dev-db/mysql

1130069256:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130069256:  ::: completed emerge (1 of 2) dev-db/mysql-4.1.14 to /

1130069256:  >>> emerge (2 of 2) dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9007 to /

1130069256:  === (2 of 2) Cleaning (dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9007::/usr/portage/dev-perl/DBD-mysql/DBD-mysql-2.9007.ebuild)

1130069256:  === (2 of 2) Compiling/Merging (dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9007::/usr/portage/dev-perl/DBD-mysql/DBD-mysql-2.9007.ebuild)

1130069279:  === (2 of 2) Post-Build Cleaning (dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9007::/usr/portage/dev-perl/DBD-mysql/DBD-mysql-2.9007.ebuild)

1130069280:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: dev-perl/DBD-mysql

1130069285: === Unmerging... (dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9003)

1130069300:  >>> unmerge success: dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9003

1130069300:  ::: completed emerge (2 of 2) dev-perl/DBD-mysql-2.9007 to /

1130069300:  *** Finished. Cleaning up...

1130069301:  *** exiting successfully.

1130069310:  *** terminating.

1130070167: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 14:22:47

1130070167:  *** emerge --oneshot --nodeps =dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20 =net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3 =dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3 =dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1 =net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3 =net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1 =net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2 =net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1 =net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6 =sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5

1130070168:  >>> emerge (1 of 10) dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20 to /

1130070168:  === (1 of 10) Cleaning (dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20::/usr/portage/dev-libs/cyrus-sasl/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20.ebuild)

1130070169:  === (1 of 10) Compiling/Merging (dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20::/usr/portage/dev-libs/cyrus-sasl/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20.ebuild)

1130070299:  === (1 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20::/usr/portage/dev-libs/cyrus-sasl/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20.ebuild)

1130070300:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: dev-libs/cyrus-sasl

1130070300:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130070300:  ::: completed emerge (1 of 10) dev-libs/cyrus-sasl-2.1.20 to /

1130070300:  >>> emerge (2 of 10) net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3 to /

1130070300:  === (2 of 10) Cleaning (net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/net-libs/libwww/libwww-5.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070301:  === (2 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/net-libs/libwww/libwww-5.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070642:  === (2 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/net-libs/libwww/libwww-5.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070643:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-libs/libwww

1130070643:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130070643:  ::: completed emerge (2 of 10) net-libs/libwww-5.4.0-r3 to /

1130070643:  >>> emerge (3 of 10) dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3 to /

1130070643:  === (3 of 10) Cleaning (dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/dev-php/mod_php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070645:  === (3 of 10) Compiling/Merging (dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/dev-php/mod_php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070900:  === (3 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3::/usr/portage/dev-php/mod_php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3.ebuild)

1130070903:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: dev-php/mod_php

1130070903:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130070903:  ::: completed emerge (3 of 10) dev-php/mod_php-4.4.0-r3 to /

1130070903:  >>> emerge (4 of 10) dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1 to /

1130070903:  === (4 of 10) Cleaning (dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1::/usr/portage/dev-php/php/php-4.4.0-r1.ebuild)

1130070904:  === (4 of 10) Compiling/Merging (dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1::/usr/portage/dev-php/php/php-4.4.0-r1.ebuild)

1130071064:  === (4 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1::/usr/portage/dev-php/php/php-4.4.0-r1.ebuild)

1130071065:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: dev-php/php

1130071065:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071065:  ::: completed emerge (4 of 10) dev-php/php-4.4.0-r1 to /

1130071065:  >>> emerge (5 of 10) net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3 to /

1130071065:  === (5 of 10) Cleaning (net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3::/usr/portage/net-analyzer/snort/snort-2.3.3.ebuild)

1130071066:  === (5 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3::/usr/portage/net-analyzer/snort/snort-2.3.3.ebuild)

1130071136:  === (5 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3::/usr/portage/net-analyzer/snort/snort-2.3.3.ebuild)

1130071137:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-analyzer/snort

1130071137:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071137:  ::: completed emerge (5 of 10) net-analyzer/snort-2.3.3 to /

1130071137:  >>> emerge (6 of 10) net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1 to /

1130071137:  === (6 of 10) Cleaning (net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1::/usr/portage/net-libs/courier-authlib/courier-authlib-0.57-r1.ebuild)

1130071138:  === (6 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1::/usr/portage/net-libs/courier-authlib/courier-authlib-0.57-r1.ebuild)

1130071303:  === (6 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1::/usr/portage/net-libs/courier-authlib/courier-authlib-0.57-r1.ebuild)

1130071304:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-libs/courier-authlib

1130071304:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071304:  ::: completed emerge (6 of 10) net-libs/courier-authlib-0.57-r1 to /

1130071304:  >>> emerge (7 of 10) net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2 to /

1130071304:  === (7 of 10) Cleaning (net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2::/usr/portage/net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2.ebuild)

1130071305:  === (7 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2::/usr/portage/net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2.ebuild)

1130071358:  === (7 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2::/usr/portage/net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2.ebuild)

1130071359:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql

1130071359:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071359:  ::: completed emerge (7 of 10) net-mail/ezmlm-idx-mysql-0.40-r2 to /

1130071359:  >>> emerge (8 of 10) net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1 to /

1130071359:  === (8 of 10) Cleaning (net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1::/usr/portage/net-mail/vpopmail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1.ebuild)

1130071360:  === (8 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1::/usr/portage/net-mail/vpopmail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1.ebuild)

1130071410:  === (8 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1::/usr/portage/net-mail/vpopmail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1.ebuild)

1130071411:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-mail/vpopmail

1130071411:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071411:  ::: completed emerge (8 of 10) net-mail/vpopmail-5.4.6-r1 to /

1130071411:  >>> emerge (9 of 10) net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6 to /

1130071411:  === (9 of 10) Cleaning (net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6::/usr/portage/net-mail/vqadmin/vqadmin-2.3.6.ebuild)

1130071412:  === (9 of 10) Compiling/Merging (net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6::/usr/portage/net-mail/vqadmin/vqadmin-2.3.6.ebuild)

1130071425:  === (9 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6::/usr/portage/net-mail/vqadmin/vqadmin-2.3.6.ebuild)

1130071426:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: net-mail/vqadmin

1130071426:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071426:  ::: completed emerge (9 of 10) net-mail/vqadmin-2.3.6 to /

1130071426:  >>> emerge (10 of 10) sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5 to /

1130071426:  === (10 of 10) Cleaning (sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5::/usr/portage/sys-auth/pam_mysql/pam_mysql-0.5.ebuild)

1130071427:  === (10 of 10) Compiling/Merging (sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5::/usr/portage/sys-auth/pam_mysql/pam_mysql-0.5.ebuild)

1130071434:  === (10 of 10) Post-Build Cleaning (sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5::/usr/portage/sys-auth/pam_mysql/pam_mysql-0.5.ebuild)

1130071435:  >>> AUTOCLEAN: sys-auth/pam_mysql

1130071435:  --- AUTOCLEAN: Nothing unmerged.

1130071435:  ::: completed emerge (10 of 10) sys-auth/pam_mysql-0.5 to /

1130071435:  *** Finished. Cleaning up...

1130071436:  *** exiting successfully.

1130071444:  *** terminating.

1130071964: Started emerge on: Oct 23, 2005 14:52:44

1130071964:  *** emerge  config =mysql-4.1.4

1130071964:  *** terminating.

```

Since authentication through vpopmail works for courier-imap, the mysql should not be the problem, should it?

What else could refuse the connection?

Thanks a lot.

----------

## Liquidcz

Hi, i have the same problem.

Any solutions?

----------

## atomicmongoose

After updaing mysql and the rest of the emerge able packages I can no longer SMTP_AUTH

KMAIL gives me:

Your SMTP server does not support PLAIN. Choose a different authentication method. The server responded: "oops, unable to write pipe and I can't auth (#4.3.0)" This is a temporary failure. You may try again later.

Thunderbird (Via IMAP ) just has me enter in my password forever.  I cannot find entries in log files that correspond to this.

Please help

----------

## CB2206

So, there seem to be several people who have probably the same problem.

Did anyone of you find a solution, yet?

Does anyone else have an idea?

----------

## newtonian

Try the solution to this problem I listed in this thread:

https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-25429-highlight-.html

Does it fix your problem?

Cheers,

----------

## Fred Krogh

I'm having similar problems.  Mail comes in fine, but when trying to send mail, I get *Quote:*   

> Send Message Error
> 
> Sending of message failed.
> 
> Error writing temporary file.

 There have been recent emerges of firefox and mysql and some other things I"ve lost track of.  I've done revdep-rebuild and re-emerged thunderbird and postfix.  Suggestions in the thread pointed to suggest stopping svscan, but I don't even have that.  Should I, and if so what do I emerge to get it??  Any other ideas.  Thanks,

Fred

----------

## newtonian

 *Fred Krogh wrote:*   

> 
> 
> I've done revdep-rebuild and re-emerged thunderbird and postfix.  Suggestions in the thread pointed to suggest stopping svscan, but I don't even have that.  Should I, and if so what do I emerge to get it??  Any other ideas.  Thanks,
> 
> Fred

 

This thread is about problems with qmail,  postfix is an entirely different MTA.  

Try searching the forums for postfix and your error message.

Cheers,

----------

## Fred Krogh

Thanks, I saw thunderbird mentioned here and thought my problem was with it.  Turns out my machine was just begin cranky.  This morning, without even restarting thunderbird (or postfix), it works!  :Question: 

Fred

----------

## CB2206

 *newtonian wrote:*   

> Try the solution to this problem I listed in this thread:
> 
> https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-25429-highlight-.html
> 
> Does it fix your problem?
> ...

 

hi,

thanks for the hint. i tried your suggestion from the other thread, but unfortunately it did not help. i still have the same problem.

i tried to use kmail, which gives me "invalid server reply (0)".

any other suggestions? it's so frustrating.... :Sad: 

----------

