# Another advice on Notebook as Desktop Replacement needed

## Master One

I didn't want to start another thread about "Which is the best Notebook for Gentoo", but I am searching and reading about that matter for days now without any real progress.

I am sick of my two old 1.3 GHz AMD Duron workstations in my two offices for me and an older Gericom notebook for my wife, not only because they are so slow, but also because I never found a solution to work on them equally (having WinXP installations, all not setup equally, matter of sharing files, as well as handling emails). My former plans to handle filesharing with a Linux-server, as well as an own IMAP mailserver for the emails have been put on ice, simply because I don't have the time to administrate that much machines by myself (also I am not a pro, and never set up a mailserver before). That's why I came to the conclusion, that it would be the best for us, to sell those old machines, and invest in two new notebooks instead, one for me (so that I can take it with me between the two offices) and one for my wife. I want two identical ones, so that I only have to do the installation (Gentoo of course, with xorg-x11 + KDE + the usual stuff) once (beginning with stage 1), and then simply copy over the files ("stage 4" install).

I already set up a list of requirements, but I am just not sure about certain details, and I did not find any real fitting offer from any of the manufacturers until now:

- Display: The larger, the better. I never understood, why 1280x1024 became mainstream on workstation LCD-panels (I remember the good old times, when I had 1600x1200 on my old 19" CRT-monitor), I think it's just too small if you like to have many programs running at once. That's why I'd prefer UXGA 1600x1200 or even WUXGA 1920x1200. I know most recommendations are for an IBM ThinkPad T42p, but that one is pretty expensive and is only available with up to 15" UXGA. Dell has quite something to offer with WUXGA, but not much people think Dell is a brand to go for. The high resolution does not have to be a downside in readability (I have seen everything get very small on a 14,1" display with 1400x1050; never saw a UXGA or XUXGA display in action for myself).

- Prozessor: Definitely a Pentium M Dothan, not especially because of the power consumption, but the ability of getting a very quite notebook (our old Gericom is louder than any other machine we had before, and it is really disturbing). I am not quite sure about which Pentium M to look for, as I have no clue how you feel the speed difference between a 1.7 / 1.8 / 2.0 GHz unit. There is quite some price difference between the three, and probably the middle way (so 1.8 GHz) will do, but I am even thinking about the 1.7, if it offers the best value on speed/power-consumption/cooling.

- RAM: I really like to have 1024 MB of memory, because I like to have quite a bunch of programs open at the same time. I am sure, this is more important than having a faster processor. If it comes down to the total costs, I may step down to 512 MB, but only if it simply upgradeable (so 1x 512 instead of 2x256 installed).

- HDD: It really should be a 7200 RPM drive, because the harddisc is always the bottleneck. I think 60 GB should be enough, I do not intend to store large video/audio files on those machines.

- Graphics: As everybody else, I'd appreciate a nVidia graphics-card over an ATI one, also the new ATI driver may already work with xorg 6.8 (but still causes troubles with resume from suspend?). I am not really a gamer, but I may want to try the one or other game, that runs natively under Linux. 128 MB RAM on the graphics card may be nice.

- Keyboard: Has to be upper class, as I am used to a MS Natural Keyboard Pro, and I have to write a lot of emails daily.

- The rest: ACPI, WLAN b/g, 1000 Mbit LAN, DVD+-RW, embedded modem, accu runtime ~4-6 hours, the usual stuff... All hardware should be supported by Linux.

I know this sounds pretty tough, and I may need to cut down one some of the requirements, if the total costs turn out to be too high (as it's not one, but two units to be bought).

I don't really know, on which brand I should concentrate on.

IBM ThinkPad T-Series seem to be the most recommended notebooks, but they are that much more expensive than others, and some specs seem not be available (WUXGA).

Is it true, that these are the only notebooks, on which ACPI is fully working under Linux?

Is the keyboard really that outstanding, compared to other manufacturers.

If have read, that LG is producing the notebooks for IBM, but that their own units should even be better? Could not find any recommendations or any more Linux related info about this manufacturer.

Dell Inspiron / Latitude / Precision are configurable at will, and the option with WUXGA is available, but as there are not really much recommendations to be found, there has to be a downside.

Is ACPI fully working?

Or is any other hardware component not working?

Is the WUXGA dispay with 1920x1200 really that outstanding (it's not only about the resolution, but also about the brightness, color, sharpness, and especially good readability)?

Is there any other manufacturer than Dell, which offers an online-hardware-components-selection-system? (It's pretty confusing looking at the huge number of already setup IBM ThinkPad units with that much differenct model-numbers)

Any suggestion a a low budget notebook, that at least comes close to most of my main requirements?

I am pretty lost right now, but I don't want to wait much longer, the sooner I buy those two new machines, the better.

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## MdaG

I'm using a DELL Latitude D800 with a 15.4" inch LCD screen. I'm running at a resolution of 1680x1050. If you want an even higher resolution there are Latitudes that offer that as well. My friends has one that handles 1920x1200. Check out DELL's Latitude for more info on them. Only downside is that you'll probably have to bitch with them if you don't want to pay for Windows XP...

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## Master One

 *MdaG wrote:*   

> I'm using a DELL Latitude D800 with a 15.4" inch LCD screen. I'm running at a resolution of 1680x1050. If you want an even higher resolution there are Latitudes that offer that as well. My friends has one that handles 1920x1200. Check out DELL's Latitude for more info on them. Only downside is that you'll probably have to bitch with them if you don't want to pay for Windows XP...

 

I already checked the online configurator for the following three Dell models:

Inspiron 9200 Superb

Latitude D800 Professional

Precision M60 Mobile Power

I am not quite sure about the general difference between the three, because they all offer similar options, and can be configured pretty much equaly.

How satisfied are you with your 1680x1050 panel? Does it have a really good readability, so that you can work with it whole day, without getting headache in the evening?

Is all the embedded hardware including ACPI fully working?

Which processor / hdd / graphics card did you choose, and are you satisfied with it (is the whole machine silent and fast enough)?

Could you get a refund for the WinXP?

I think I will have to play arround with Dell's online-configurator for some more time. At least they seem to have a pretty good service-network here in Austria (not sure which service option is the better solution: 3 year pick-up-service or 3 year on-spot-service on next working day).

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## MdaG

I'd been running XP for a year on my d800 so a refund is out of the question (it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to late for that).

These are my specs:

 *Quote:*   

> Pentium M 1.4 GHz
> 
> WSXGA+ LCD 15.4"
> 
> 768Mb 266MHz DDRAM Memory
> ...

 

It's really fast. The only things I haven't tried in Gentoo is the modem and WLAN. The latter I know works from various webpages on the net.

I LOVE my screen. Crystal sharp. I've never had a better one.

The computer is silent most of the time. The fan doesn't speed up until the CPU gets hot and it does it in stages. The highest volume is achieved when emerged large packages.

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## Master One

Sounds great. It looks like Dell is pretty underestimated, and I really am going to look into it. The idea of having 1920x1200 screen resolution is pretty stunning (is Dell the only one using such panels?), and the rest of the selectable equipment is also pretty nice (especially to be able to choose a nVidia graphics card). APCI is important for me, I want to get the suspend & resume to work properly and reliable. Are there really not any issues, I should be aware about Dell notebooks?

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## MdaG

I'm quite new to Linux and since I use my notebook as my desktop system I'm not using suspend. So I don't know about ACPI. I don't know about any other company that uses WUXGA technology, but DELL can't be the only ones. One thing that I don't like is that DELL doesn't have any software support what so ever. But their hardware support is great!

*edit*

You can ask other d800 users on this newsgroup:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/linux-latitude-d800/

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## Master One

 *MdaG wrote:*   

> I'm quite new to Linux and since I use my notebook as my desktop system I'm not using suspend. So I don't know about ACPI. I don't know about any other company that uses WUXGA technology, but DELL can't be the only ones. One thing that I don't like is that DELL doesn't have any software support what so ever. But their hardware support is great!

 

APCI with suspend/resume can be usefull for any desktop/mobile/workstation use. I only know it from WinXP, you just send your machine to suspend, which works way faster than shutdown, and next time you switch the computer on, it quickly is back where you left it before the suspend. I think, this proceeding is the total replacement, so under normal circumstances you never should need to shutdown your machine again completely.

I am still not into the details, but I have read something about swsuspend2 as a kernel patch (included in some larger patchsets), which is the advanced suspend/resume with additional features, and that one will probably replace the normal suspend/resume of kernel 2.6.10 in the future.

But all this stuff is only working, if ACPI is fully supported on the used computer of course.

Concerning Dell: Surfing their website, I found out, that the Inspiron 9200 Superb has a 17" WUXGA display, but the Latitude D800 Professional & Precision M60 Mobile Power only a 15,4" WUXGA. Concerning the connectivity I like the Latitude more, but I am concerned, that the 15,4" with 1920x1200 will be a disadvantage in readability compared to the 17" display of the Inspiron. As already mentioned, I've not seen both display live in action personally, so I can't really tell, how the impression would be. I also have no idea, if there is a place locally here in Austria, where I can see both units live in action.

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## MdaG

E-mail DELL and ask.

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## gen2doggy

go here, you'll save on the thinkpad "book" price.

http://www.thinkpads.com

get a thinkpad t-series.

it might also be worth noting the T43 is out very shortly - so maybe wait see what happens with prices?

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## Master One

 *gen2doggy wrote:*   

> go here, you'll save on the thinkpad "book" price.
> 
> http://www.thinkpads.comget a thinkpad t-series. it might also be worth noting the T43 is out very shortly - so maybe wait see what happens with prices?

 

Still reading, reading and reading. I found some reviews on the Dell Inspiron 9200, and that unit really looks very pleasing in most matters (also it may not be perfect). I really can't believe, that there is no compareable unit to the Inspiron 9200 with such a nice 17" WUXGA 1920x1200 high quality LCD panel out there. Using various search terms, the only other notebook with such a display is a Sony Vaio, but buying a Sony is out of question.

I still don't get the hype about the IBM ThinkPad T42p. It "only" comes with up to 15" UXGA 1600x1200, and all model types are pretty nasty exspensive, which may be the main reason, why I could not find any real good reviews on that unit until now (anyone has a link to a detailed review?). I do not assume, the enhanced security features, as well as the fingerprint reader, are of any use under Linux anyway, right?

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## Master One

Oh boy, I'm just reading the user opinions on reviews.cnet.com about the Dell Inspiron 9200, and pretty much everybody is writing, that the Dell 17" WUXGA screen totally sucks. This is a total surprise, because I found a German review, in which nothing negative about the screen was mentioned.

I really was into the idea of having a 17" with 1920x1200, as I never can have enough space on screen, but if it's such an eye-killer with various negative impacts (overall bad display quality, especially when viewed on white background and bright environment) and therefore bad readability, the idea of purchasing a Dell is dead. I really need something that meets the eye, I want to be able to work with the unit all day without getting eye-dizzyness & headache.

I am still looking for an online-review of the IBM ThinkPad T42p, as well as some user opinions. Especially I'd like to get feedback on the 15" UXGA 1600x1200 screen from people, who sit in front of such a unit all day.

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## Master One

Well, I just got a call-back from a Dell sales manager. Fact is: Forget the Inspiron 9200 with WUXGA screen! They refuse to admit, that any information about the bad display quality is known. The woman I spoke to, made a query to a technician, but then told me, it may be better for me NOT to buy this product, as it would not be possible to return it, if I am not satisfied with the display. There is also no possibility to see that unit live in action (of course, we are talking about Dell here).

So I think I finally can get rid of the idea about a 1920x1200 WUXGA display, because it is most likely that other manufacturers may also not get any better results with that display size. Additional comments on that matter are welcome of course.

That written, I will now concentrate on the 15" 1600x1200 UXGA screen size, so the IBM ThinkPad T42p is still in the race. I am still searching for a serious review of that unit, and I also would appreciate some more other suggestions.

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## gen2doggy

again, check the forums at thinkpads.com, there's plenty of comments there about the various display sizes from people both in your position and people who actually own the units

have you looked at the ibm G series? I've not checked them out myself, but I believe that is the desktop replacement range - might be worth a try

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## Master One

Took a look at forum.thinkpads.com, quite some more info, but until now not very helpfull in details, especially as not a single topic can be found on the ThinkPad model that got my closer attention.

It's the following IBM ThinkPad T42P (UC2F4GE / 2373-F4G):

- 15" UXGA 1600x1200 TFT panel

- ATI Mobility FireGL T2 128 MB 4xAGP

- Intel Pentium M 745 1.80 GHz FSB 400

- Intel 855PM chipset

- 1 GB PC 2700 / 333 DDR

- 60 GB ATA-100 EIDE (hopefully this is really the 7200 RPM?)

- DVD Recordable 2x EIDE (no idea, if this is the multi / dual-layer burner?)

- 56k V.92 faxmodem

- IR / Intel 802.11bg / Bluetooth / Intel PRO/1000 Gigabit Ethernet

- IBM ThinkPad UltraNav / Full size keyboard with keyboard light

- 6 cell lithium-ion battery

- IBM Security features with fingerprint reader

I can get that unit here for about 2.520,- EURO (excl. VAT) -> if I order it on monday, I should have it in hands on tuesday.

Any comments on that machine?

I think it sounds pretty good, also a little expensive, it may well be worth the money.

I am only a little concerned about the first installation. WinXP will come preinstalled, and I want to convert that notebook to a Gentoo only machine. I've read about some important things to back up, before starting the Gentoo install.

The only real uncertainty may be about the security features, which most likely will be of no use under Linux. I already searched for info about the fingerprint reader & Linux, but nothing came up except the Linux TCPA driver from the IBM site http://www.research.ibm.com/gsal/tcpa/

Not sure what that driver is supposed to do, and if anyone could get it to do something usefull. Any more comments are highly appreciated.

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## gen2doggy

why not start a new topic on thinkpads.com regarding the t42p then!

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## Master One

 *gen2doggy wrote:*   

> why not start a new topic on thinkpads.com regarding the t42p then!

 

Already did   :Wink: 

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## gen2doggy

I'm there dude!!!!!

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## Master One

What a bad timing. I just was so into buying the mentioned T42p model, but then I read all 16 pages of the "T43 Discussion" thread on forum.thinkpads.com, and now I am totally uncertain again. These are my thoughts:

- Usually I am for the tactic, to buy a new item at the beginning of a product cycle, so that would speak rather for the T43p, than the T42p.

- There may be advantages on both items (T42p better power consumption, T43p better graphics card), and they tend to have an equal value, but the T43 is a complete new generation.

- If I buy the mentioned T42p model now, it costs me about 2.520,- EURO (excl. VAT), but I expect a drop in price soon due to the upcoming T43 series (that may be the reason, why our wholesaler didn't sell a single pcs. in 4 days now, they still have 83 units in stock). I read something about a refund from IBM, if the price drops within 30 days of purchase, but I don't think this is valid for Europe, and especially not, if it is not bought from the IBM website directly (so this would not help me at all, and therefore buying NOW would be just too risky).

- I've seen comments from people, who just purchased a T42(p), and they already regret that after reeding the T43 infos (and I don't want to end up like this).

- The T43p (an equal model like the T42p I mentioned above) most likely will not be available until April / May, so it's still a long time to wait.

I am really lost again now. Anyone here also waiting with me for the T43p to show up, or nevertheless is going to buy a T42p (right now, or waiting for a price drop)?

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## Master One

Another new factor may be the new Dell Inspiron 9300, which should come out earlier than the ThinkPad T43p. That one comes with a 17" wide-screen and a nVidia GeForce FX 6800 Go PCI-Express with 256 MB GDDR3. Also I know the quality is less superior than any ThinkPad, if they should get the problems with the WUXGA 1920x1600 screen fixed (that's the screen-size I always wanted), it again may be worth a consideration.

Damned, the more I read, the more difficult it gets...

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## Master One

 *Master One wrote:*   

> It's the following IBM ThinkPad T42P (UC2F4GE / 2373-F4G):
> 
> - 15" UXGA 1600x1200 TFT panel
> 
> - ATI Mobility FireGL T2 128 MB 4xAGP
> ...

 

Damned, this is really driving me nuts! I just checked the price for that piece again, and it already dropped down to 2.425,- EURO (excl. VAT).

If I only knew, what to do.... The closer the release of the T43p series comes (with April still far away), the cheaper it probably will get... But how much can that unit still drop???

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## Master One

I finally decided to order the mentioned IBM ThinkPad T42P (UC2F4GE / 2373-F4G) tomorrow. After the last price drop it really shows the best value to me.

I came to the conclusion, that it's not worth waiting for an equal T43p, as the price will be a lot higher for only a little more performance (both, the new 2.1 GHz CPU, as well as the DDR533 SO DIMMs are way too expensive).

The only T43p, which is already listed at our wholesaler, is the UC3H2GE / 2668H2G, but that will have an initial price of (hold your breath!) 3.700,57 EURO (excl. VAT) .... ARGE!!! This is completely out of question for me.

BTW I'll also order two pcs. of PortReplicator II, one power supply and two 7port USB2.0 hubs. I found a great offer on ebay for the PortReplicator II and the power supply, and the mentioned equipment is so much cheaper than going for two MiniDock dockingstations, it was the ultimate bargain and offers a much better solution (due to the 7 USB-ports compared to only 4 in the MiniDock).

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## gen2doggy

nice one just recently ordered my t42p should be here tomorrow, let me know how you get on!

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## Master One

Mine should arrive on Friday.

I think the first thing to do, is to burn the recovery CDs (so that you can "reset" the ThinkPad to factory-default incl. the hidden recovery partition), wipe the whole disk, and make a Stage 1 installation with double bootstrap (second one with gcc 3.4 and -march=pentium-m).

This will be a Gentoo-only machine, no dual boot with that crap of other OS...   :Very Happy: 

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## gen2doggy

same 'ere!

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## Master One

Yeah, that's the way it should be...   :Cool: 

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## Master One

Ok, I finally got my new IBM ThinkPad T42p (UC2F4GE / 2373-F4G) on last friday. This machine is absolutly awsome, I could not imagine of how impressed I will be when I finally have it in my hands. When I switched it on the first time, I had to recheck if it really was running, since you can not hear anything at all (speaking as a former user of an old Gericom P4 notebook, which make a hell of a noise)  :Very Happy: 

I spent this weekend checking all aspects of the unit for beeing fully functional, that it got the right parts built in (Thai keyboard, Sony battery, 7200 RPM harddrive, PC2700 memory, no dead or stuck pixels on the UXGA FlexView screen, and so on...), and performing all tests with the included PC-Doctor.

I already set up the fingerprint reader usage for power-on / hdd-access / bios-access (works OS independent, but has to be set up using the enloses WinXP software), made two sets of Rescue & Recovery CDs (first one on 7 CD-Rs, second one after the update of the IBM Rescue & Recovery software on 1 CD-R & 1 DVD-R), and now I am ready to wipe the WinXP & hidden partition, to install Gentoo Linux as my only OS.

I am so happy with this piece of hardware, I don't remember ever getting that excited about a new "toy".

I already bought two new IBM Port Replicator II on ebay (each for only 110,82 EURO incl. P&P with full IBM warranty), and on last Sunday I managed to catch a Kingston Value RAM 1 GB SO-DIMM PC2700 for only 154,83 EURO incl. P&P (it's a used one, but Kingston has lifetime-warranty on all memory sticks, so it should not matter). In addition to those items, I also ordered two 7-port USB2.0 hubs and a Dicota notebook-bag, so I am really fully equipped now.  :Smile: 

I'll perform a "Stage 1 on a Stage 3 tarball" installation, to benefit from the -march=pention-m flag of gcc 3.4, and I just decided to use reiser4 as filesystem, which will blow socks on the embedded 7200 RPM harddrive. I hope, that I can set everything up fine, since I want to get swsusp2 fully functional with the latest ATI binary drivers (have read about some problems on that issue).

What else can I say, I am just so excited about all that stuff, which makes it hard to concentrate now on my daily work...  :Wink: 

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## Joelio

 *Master One wrote:*   

> 
> 
> What else can I say, I am just so excited about all that stuff, which makes it hard to concentrate now on my daily work... 

 

I fully understand!  :Wink: 

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