# Webmin replacement ?

## eXess

Hi all, 

It's been weeks since I first saw this message while doing emerge --sync : 

```
!!! Ebuilds for the following packages are either all

!!! masked or don't exist:

app-admin/webmin
```

ok so 1.400 has a major security issue, 1.400-r1 seems to have that too as it is still masked in Portage, and 1.410 is current on webmin website but I can't determine if it is secure or not and it's not in Portage at all. Anyway, no webmin available whatsoever. 

As I run webmin on 2 servers I'm an administrator for, I'm really concerned about the security issue here. Can't find anything about this on the forum so I'm just asking : what's wrong with Webmin ? will it be fixed or should I consider using another product ? and if I should switch, what are my options ? things like cPanel, Plesk and such are either not free and/or not in Portage. So,what are you guys using ? 

Oh, and btw please don't discuss general topics : we all know that system administration tools are by definition dangerous and should, if possible, not be accessible from the internet, and other basic security tricks. I'm just looking for a solution with Webmin OR a replacement. Thank you in advance all !  :Smile: 

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## ToeiRei

well... what exactly do you do with webmin?

Rei

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## baaann

 *Quote:*   

> Can't find anything about this on the forum so I'm just asking : what's wrong with Webmin ? will it be fixed or should I consider using another product ?

 

https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=217582

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## eXess

> Rei 

I do system administration. This is a server box with Gentoo, no X, and some servers (apache with PHP, mysql, postfix, atalk, etc). For basic tasks such as system maintenance, emerging new packets, configuring and such, SSH is great. For adding and managing users and quickly overseeing whole system, Webmin is cool because of the gfx interface. 

Basically, I need a system manager with a graphical interface (ie web access)... 

Any ideas ?

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## julot

Well in my opinion Webmin always was a "mixed up" set of tools with different quality results; 2 Years ago, made a mess with my postfix config file, and apache also.

I believe if you are accustomed to use ssh and do all by yourself, There’s no need for webmin.  Even in the “added value” plug-ins, example: 

- If you need to review logs, use a log viewer with a trusted IP from syslog.

- If you need the java explorer like interface, you can use Winscp, whom even does that in secure mode.

- Phpmyadmin does an extremely well job instead of poor Webmin script in databases.

And if you search, you will find always something to not use Webmin.  Or simply edit the config file.

In the normal use of administrator/power user and even a home/small office user.  All tasks can be substituted with better counterparts, with every package changing so fast there is no need for middleware, so at the end of the day Webmin is only a Linux starter set of tools.

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## eXess

Fair enough... Thinking about it, my main use of it is users management (create, delete, change password). I know it can be done with the shell, so I guess I'll just try and change my habits. But I'll miss the "batch" functions of Webmin (creating 100+ users each year, as this is the school's development server)... Thanks anyway.

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## spottraining

When I discover Gentoo - it was best distribution ever. I recommended it always, as good distribution for servers. Now - after years I have seen, how Gentoo phase out. Something is very wrong with Gentoo development, and now I even don't understand - who is Gentoo distribution target.

I don't recommend nobody to use Gentoo in servers. Years ago - there was very easy to maintain servers. No problems. When You made some upgrade and something doesn't work as you excepted, you have always possibility to go back to old version. Simply to mask new version in portage and reinstalling the old version. There was mostly two or three older version also possible to use in Portage. I really like this solution. In server, there two or three times I discover, that some version doesn't work well with my control panel or other software. Then I roll back and made tray after some time - or I have possibility to find information. 

Also - updates come out very fast. New version of software come out and after week it was already in Gentoo portage.

What is situation right now - Gentoo drops support even for stable software (like Apache 2.0, what is no longer supported). Updates - newer knows, when they coming out. Also - you don't have possibility to roll back at many cases any more. Its like Ubuntu already - new stable version is released to portage - so older ebuilds are removed. Even there is no security issues - you don't have possibility to roll back at many cases.

Webmin is good software, that shows these problems in Gentoo. There is already 1.420 version out - but in Gentoo portage - here is nothing.

These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest  know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH. Also - many regular users needs also some control panel for they tasks and webmin is for this best free solution.

So lets hope, that Gentoo brings webmin back asap. Until this - there is possibility to upgrade webmin inside webmin itself. I have used this to some modules.

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## xtz

 *spottraining wrote:*   

> These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH.

 You can't use SSH, but u can afford to manage the system with webmin? Nice!

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## Anarcho

 *xtz wrote:*   

>  *spottraining wrote:*   These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH. You can't use SSH, but u can afford to manage the system with webmin? Nice!

 

I'm curious, too. I usually using SSH for everything but had to install webmin last thursday for a customer. OK, it works, but I'm not feeling very comfortable. I will stick with SSH. Reading the comments on config-files is in most cases a very valuable information which you don't get every time in webmin. But I can understand for "mostly windows admins" that they prefere something like webmin.

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## AllenJB

webmin is still in portage (see The Gentoo Handbook: Mixing Software Branches for information on dealing with ~arch packages), altho it's slightly behind so you might want to consider giving the version bump request a nudge (and a vote) - perhaps with an up-to-date tested ebuild.

As for Apache 2.0, this is now considered "legacy" by Apache which means it is receiving only bug fixes, no new features. Apache 2.2 is considered the current stable, fully supported version. While Gentoo could maintain Apache 2.0, the most likely reason it doesn't is simply man power - it takes time and effort to maintain packages in portage to the level expected and there just aren't enough Gentoo developers to maintain every version of every package that people want to use. Of course, you can help with that...

You can always obtain any package that has been in portage from the version control system, altho obviously no guarantees are made about the ability to download the required files.Last edited by AllenJB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:13 pm; edited 2 times in total

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## spottraining

 *xtz wrote:*   

>  *spottraining wrote:*   These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH. You can't use SSH, but u can afford to manage the system with webmin? Nice!

 

I am traveling a lot. At many cases I have checked out my server from public computers and made modification. Mostly its needed to change some ownership, add rights to users or add e-mails etc.

Also - with webmin is possible to manage server even over mobile phone - also its needed two or three times.

With Webmin I know - I can to that at every country and with every computer. With SSH - You need your own laptop allways.

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## AllenJB

 *spottraining wrote:*   

>  *xtz wrote:*    *spottraining wrote:*   These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH. You can't use SSH, but u can afford to manage the system with webmin? Nice! 
> 
> I am traveling a lot. At many cases I have checked out my server from public computers and made modification. Mostly its needed to change some ownership, add rights to users or add e-mails etc.
> 
> Also - with webmin is possible to manage server even over mobile phone - also its needed two or three times.
> ...

 

Er, you can get SSH clients for mobile phones and you can access SSH from any computer that has web access (two words: java applets)

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## xtz

 *spottraining wrote:*   

>  *xtz wrote:*    *spottraining wrote:*   These - who saying, that only SSH is good. It shows, that these people doest know nothing about server market. You don't have any time possibility to use SSH. You can't use SSH, but u can afford to manage the system with webmin? Nice! 
> 
> I am traveling a lot. At many cases I have checked out my server from public computers and made modification. Mostly its needed to change some ownership, add rights to users or add e-mails etc.
> 
> Also - with webmin is possible to manage server even over mobile phone - also its needed two or three times.
> ...

 What's the problem, to get a ssh client for your mobile phone? There are PLENTY of them. You can even use MidpSSH for MIDP-capable phones, there are others for Symbian OS or Windows Mobile based devices. And I don't think a ssh client can only be installed on your own laptop  :Smile: 

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## beandog

The world is not coming to an end because webmin is marked as *unstable*.  Freak.

Here's the timeline:

NOBODY was maintaining webmin.

It was going to be dropped completely from the tree.

I took over maintainership because I like to use it.

There were lots of bugs, some of them which could screw up your system.

Some of the bugs were in the stabled versions.

I rekeyworded it as unstable, because it is, and dropped all but the latest version.

I'm now fixing bugs when I have free time.

As far as the package itself, it works fine for me, for what I use it for.  If you want to run it, by all means just put it in package.keywords like anything else, and realize you run the risk of it breaking something, just like every other ebuild marked unstable.

On a practical matter -- there are bugs and I need both patches and people to test them since I can't do everything myself.  If you want to help out, it would be, of course, greatly appreciated.  As always, feel free to contact me directly or post your comments on bugzilla.

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